Found to be listed with Springfield Research with the following information. The deficiencies were studied and methods to improve the rifles performance were evaluated. It started looking at it in 1878, a scant two years after the defeat of General George Custer at Little Bighorn. Some years ago I was asking an arms expert about a musket from the American Revolution which had famous battles carved on the stock, and the fellow said that some rifles of that time and later were carved to falsely imply that the rifle had been used in some historical event, done to enhance the sale price of the firearm at some later time, possibly at about the time of the Centennial of the US in 1876. "Krag carbine rough riders serial numbers" #3 05-30-2021, 09:38 AM themeowman : Join Date: Oct 2009 . It was converted from a "Cavalry Model" to an "Artillery Model" at that time by fitting a 5 1/2 inch barrel in place . U.S. Model 1892 Krag-Jorgensen Rifle. Click the image to load the highest resolution version. The simple answer is that as the M1903 rifle began coming into active service, the Krags were passed first to State regiments to replace the old M1873s, and then as the Springfields and the M1917 rifles equipped the last units of the various State National Guard regiments, the Krags were returned to the Federal Government, which disposed of them as surplus. 2801 W. Airport Freeway The left side of the receiver is marked with: "1895 U.S. SPRINGFIELD ARMORY 24978", indicating that it falls into the generally accepted, but slightly below the serial number range of the Teddy Roosevelt "Rough Riders" unit carbines. We searched online for the term Silent Guns in connection with the Spanish American War and located two pieces of poetry containing the term. Plus just from family History, I'd say its a Definitive this rifle was AT/IN the Spanish-American War AND the Phillipine InsurrectionWas it one of THE "Rough Riders" Carbines.It falls in the Serial Line, and matches the description of the rifles requested/issued/used. Are all serial numbers matching? When the United States entered World War I in 1917, approximately 160,000 Krag rifles were still in storage, and significant numbers (mainly Model 1898 rifles) were withdrawn and used by the U.S. military during the war. See here for a list of units. 2023 Heritage Auctions | All Rights Reserved. Rough Riders Carbine. US MILITARIA FORUM - COLLECTORS PRESERVING HISTORY Soon after the Krag carbines were in service, they saw some use against the remaining renegade Apaches who still terrorized parts of Arizona and New Mexico throughout the late 1890s. As the new Krag rifles began to see use, a number of deficiencies came to light, requiring minor redesign of some components. Other Variants In addition to the Krag rifles and carbines, there were limited numbers of other variants produced including cadet rifles and .22-cal. One of the most documented guns we have ever catalogued, it comes with a two inch thick dossier of information about its owner, Alvin Ash, and about the gun itself. It is interesting to note that the carbine pictured & described here is close in serial number to the 1895 carbines issued to Theodore Roosevelt's 'Rough Riders'. [ Read Responses | Post a New Response | Return to the Index ] Trapdoor in butt with three-piece cleaning rod present. Metal mostly smooth with clear markings. While the Ordnance Dept. By May 1896, all regular U.S. Army cavalry units were equipped with Model 1896 Krag carbines. Help for civilians and veterans seeking information and military records, past and present. and 40 grains of smokeless propellant. Regular Army Cavalry Regiments were equipped with the M1896 Carbine, and due to the political influence of the Lieutenant Colonel of the 1st Volunteer Cavalry, they were also equipped with the same carbine as the Regular Army. Unfortunately that was all . As with the Model 1892 rifle, the stocks were marked with an inspection stamp on the left side that contained the initials of Springfield Armorys master armorer and the year of production. September 16, 2022 in RIFLES. Brophy, in his book The Krag Rifle, claims that the .22 Gallery Practice Rifles were newly manufactured weapons. The fourth block is over 5,000 numbers, and again lots of units are represented. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. [1] Though armoured no better than the average Guardsman, their speed and maneuverability is . Krag Collectors Association Forum . Another interesting variant was a slightly modified version of the Model 1899 carbine (along with a few Model 1898 carbines) fitted with a cut-down Model 1898 rifle stock. So, it may just be a poorly maintained rifle about which you can spin a tale or two if you are so inclined. Like many of the other repeating military rifles of the era, the Krag was fitted with a magazine cut-off that permitted it to function as a single-loader with the magazine held in reserve as required. One of the Krags salient features was the horizontal box magazine and loading gate on the right side of the action/receiver that enabled it to be loaded and unloaded with the bolt open or closed. M1 Garand Rifle Review: How Does This Old War Horse Hold Up Today? Or it could have been carved by someone who simply wished to commemorate one of the most famous military engagements at which similar rifles were used. Surely, it was reasoned, there had to be a home-grown rifle at least as good as the foreign intruder. Mailing Address: Is this something that you have gotten from family and are related to William T. Earle? Not sure what kind of money you could get that way but you could possibly keep it in the family and still get some $$. The Mausers clip-loading capability was markedly superior to the Krags magazine design, which had to be loaded with individual cartridges. on GB the NON-Saddle Ringed are selling for $4000. Although the U.S. militarys standard service arm for less than a decade, the Krag saw a surprising amount of service during the time that the United States was becoming a world power. During this period some Krag carbines were also carried by cavalry units patrolling Yellowstone Park to prevent game poaching. Then at least there's a chance for you to get back. Best of luck with your research! PS. See here for a list of units. If Brophy is correct, then the highest possible serial number that could appear on a U.S. Krag-Jorgensen is . Was there a troop that were called the "Silent Guns" that was involved in this battle? Three Things to Know About Heritage Live! This poem was collected in Spanish-American War Songs: A Complete Collection of Newspaper Verse During the Recent War with Spain published in 1898. Jan. 18th 1887'. Save up to 30% when you upgrade to an image pack. Sign up for a new account in our community. Kevin. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. They are worth well in excess of $3,000!! Would be so nice to own a verified RR model, but I enjoy it as is very much. The only definitive method of identifying one of the so-called NRA Carbines would be with an original bill of sale from the governmentquite rare today. . Nonetheless, the most famous volunteer outfit of the war, the 1st U.S. Volunteer Cavalry, better known as the Rough Riders, was armed with new Model 1896 Krag carbines. U.S. Model 1892 Krag. Unlike most examples, this was not upgraded later to 1902 standards, and also it was not fitted with a saddle ring as most were (See Flayderman's Guide to Antique Firearms). About 60% of the serial numbers are in the 27010 to 28995 range, including #27508, which is only 9 lower than this gun. Wishful thinking may make us want to believe that a close number has to share the same usage as a documented number, but it is just not the case. LetCowan'sAssistWithYour Shipping Needs! Based on my research, the RR range of serial numbers cluster in the ranges 27010 to 28995, 35164 to 35741, 68013 to 68758 and 74097 to 79499. Two or three prototype Model 1898 Krag sniper rifles fitted with Cataract telescopic sights were assembled for limited testing. So it is a good representative Spanish-American War Krag carbine and probably was issued to a unit bound for Cuba or the Philippines. By 1890 the United States was lagging behind other industrialized nations in the development of a modern military rifle. I've got all the research that the "Springfield Armory Society" sent me listing all the "Official" post-discharge requests from soldiers of the 1st, 3rd, and 10th US Cavalry who actually wrote in WITH the serial number of the rifle they were issued, requesting to buy it back from the government, as far as the Krags go, Springfield and the Gov't kept very little official records of distributions by serial number. An improved rear sight, designated the Model 1901, was subsequently developed for the Krag and installed on new production Model 1898 Krag rifles beginning in August 1901. Ashs Krag is up for grabs (Photo: Skinner). 19.5% of the successful bid (minimum $14) per lot. Model 1898 Krag Carbine A carbine version of the new arm was adopted concurrently with the Model 1898 rifle. Thanks for any help #2 05-30-2021, 08:04 AM . The rifle was 49.1 inches in overall length with a 30-inch barrel and . considering the documented history of this gun, have you looked at seeing if any museums might want to buy it? Of the 841 .22's manufactured, 500 were made in 1905 and 341 made in 1906. Mechanically functional, good bore which is dirty and shows even light pitting along its length. The fact that a foreign gun was chosen over the American designs was an unpopular decision with some of the interested parties, and this displeasure was soon voiced to their respective congressional representatives. As I recall, they only have serial numbers for two of the 10 troops. We all pay our dues in this hobby. While its bolt-action mechanism and unique magazine system proved to be somewhat anachronistic soon after its adoption, the U.S. Krag was a well-crafted firearm that, within its limits, served our nation well from the late 19th century and into the 20th. SPRINGFIELD ARMORY. I have a nice 1896 pattern as well but in the 88,000 range. Important: Use our map link to see location / directions. If anyone is really interested I'd take an M1A and 2K for the Krag.for a used standard M1A and 2K I'd say that's a pretty fair deal. Only 5001 were ever made, compared to many more rifles. This Seller Accepts Instant Online Payments Description: This carbine is a very nice example of the Springfield Armory 30-40 Krag Jorgensen Model 1896carbine that was used by American "Rough Riders", troops during the Spanish American war including the charge up San Juan Hill in Cuba. Although the basic Krag action remained relatively unchanged, there were numerous modifications, including the elimination of the under-barrel cleaning rod in favor of a jointed three-piece rod carried in a buttstock recess, the strengthening of the stock, and an improvement to the rear sightstill lacking windage adjustment, however. Fixed blade front and 2,000 yard "C" marked ladder rear sights. Sling ring and bar intact. Blued finish, finger groove, straight grip smooth walnut stock. This resulted in development of the Parkhurst Clip Loading Attachment, which enabled the Krag magazine to be loaded by means of a five-round charger. American forces involved in the Battle of San Juan Hill, also known as the Battle of San Juan Heights consisted of the Fifth Army Corps, divided into the 1st Division with three brigades, and the Cavalry Division (dismounted) with two. However, a list of people named "William T---" who served at the Battle of San Juan Hill would likely be fairly lengthy, as the previous answer gives the scale of troops present at that fight. I did a web search of the phrase Silent Guns and could not find it in any of the slang dictionaries of that era mentioned on the web, but to me it seems to imply that the user of the rifle has shot or killed 9 persons in combat. I buy on gunbroker, but never actually sold on there before, guess that'll be my next stop, along with armslist. How to Use Classifieds - PLEASE READ FIRST ! As usual, usage data is incomplete, but many other units are listed in that range, and while the 1st USV is the most commonly found, that probably is more a lack of records being found for other units than any sort of serious concentration. See the second picture for the serial number of this gun. We also recommend searching online and in libraries for published histories of the regiments present at the battle, as they sometimes include lists of soldier names. These are numbered by the fiscal year July 1st to June 30th. Krag rifle and carbine. NRA LIFE, GCA MEMBER, IATSE LOCAL#21,CJR&P. Buying a Krag Jorgensen Hearing protection is a must while shooting. My only thoughts is that it refers to the upgrade in the Trapdoor gun from the previous, which caused a lot of black powder to be released, hence the shooter an easy target for the Spanish army. Or, more actually, my first. It can be impossible to distinguish one of these civilian-made cut-down Krag rifles from one of the rifles modified at Benicia and sold via the NRA. All her entire life Channing, a girl from the East Coast has struggled to be what her parent's desire, but she wants to let loose for the first time in her life. Very few early Krag carbines, especially those dated 1895, are when found, in anything other than well used/ arsenal modified condition with little or no finish. Krag Jorgensen serial number ranges by year. The barrel, handguard, sights, furniture and most of the other features were also the same as the Model 1896 carbine. There is no evidence that any were used by front-line combat units. The iconic single action wheel guns defined a legacy that continues to stand the test of time, earning a home in the collection of any shooter. https://archive.org/details/storyroughrider01marsgoog/page/n332, http://oldguns.net/sn_php/mildateslookup.php. because according to the Springfield Research Service Serial Numbers book, Volume 4 ( 1999 Edition) serial number 334043 was manufactured in 1901, after San Juan Hill. It is probable that the political influence of units second-in-command, Lt. Col. Theodore Roosevelt, had something to do with the outfit being armed with the new bolt-action carbines rather than Trapdoors. For the record, the fiscal year ran from July - June. Turns out it was a cut-down rifle made to look like a carbine. The Krag up at auction Friday at Skinner is a carbine model meant for horse-mounted cavalry use, and as such has a saddle ring mounted to the rifle one of the last U.S.-made martial rifles to have such a feature. Typing our address directly into a map search may misdirect you. Museums, Historical Societies, and Institutional Services. Still Available..Taking offersPartial Trades are cool too. He died when my grandpa was very young so he never passed on his military info. 1894: 1-2,953 1895: 2,954-16,384 1896: 16,385-32,647 1897: 32,648-64,557 The nonadjustable Model 1896 rear sight continued to be used on the Model 1898s until the Model 1898 rear sight, which was adjustable for windage, was adopted. In addition to the fighting in Cuba, the Krags also saw extensive use in the Philippine Islands, which the United States acquired after the Spanish-American War. Very expensive and hard to find these days. The unit mustered in 47 officers and 994 enlisted men, so probably about 900 were armed with Krag carbines, so about 20% of the numbers have been found. Weve published a few stories on the M1 Garand here at Guns.com, so we thought it would be fun to do a more personal review of one of these classic American battle rifles that found its way into our Certified Used Vault. The stock is also very good with clear cartouche, some cracks around the magazine and side plate, along with some light chipping around the toe and scattered scratches and dents. I have seen auctions for identified RR carbines including #27694 (175 away from this carbine) and the article in Man at Arm,s Vol. The SRS database lists 186 Model 1896 Krag carbines associated with Roosevelt's 1st U.S. Volunteer Cavalry "Rough Riders.". Virtually all of the Model 1898 carbines were eventually modified to Model 1899 configuration and fitted with the various updated sights. Heritage Live! Krags provided valuable service in numerous small-scale, but brutal and bloody, combat actions against various indigenous insurgent groups. We have detected that you do not have JavaScript enabled. The new rifle was adopted as the "United States Magazine Rifle, Caliber .30, Model of 1892.". Learn more about how you can collaborate with us. This conversion work continued through Fiscal Year 1902. Also, the Mausers stronger bolt-action mechanism enabled it to use higher-velocity cartridges having more power and better performance than the .30-40 Krag. On July 1, residents with a clean criminal history of legal age in Florida will be able to carry concealed without a permit. But like the M1911A1, the Colt 1908 Pocket Hammerless was drafted from peacetime to wartime service. 2023 Rock Island Auction Company. So how did this rifle come to be in the condition indicated by your photographs? In case anyone who sees this who is an arms buff, the model and serial number are: "U.S. Model 1898 Springfield Armory 334043". The remaining rifles were from various U.S. and foreign inventors or manufacturers. My first was bought from a fellow wandering a gun show at the Phoenix Fairgrounds about 25 years ago. Description: This is a nice unaltered Model 1896 Krag carbine with 22" barrel in .30-40 Krag. [ Previous | Previous in Thread | Next in Thread | Next ]. The Volunteer Cavalry (the Rough Riders . The Regular Army Infantry Regiments in Cuba were issued with the M1892 model rifle, some of which were upgraded to the M1896 pattern, although this upgrade program . By RIAC believes that this website is accessible to the widest possible audience pursuant to the guidelines of the Americans with Disability Act. Rifles and Carbines Models 1892 to 1899: Covering numbers: 1 - 484000. We know that he was in the Spanish American War and have some other info that looks like he was wounded at the Battle of Santiago de Cuba. Does anyone know the serial number range for the Krag carbines issued to the Rough Riders? In that context, I have no idea what the vertical lines or the "Silent Guns" could be a reference to - although if were done by a veteran who wished to commemorate friends killed at the battle, that could an explanation. Still has the three piece cleaning rod set in the butt! Instead, you may view these records online at one of NARA's facilities for free via a NARA PC. This is a nice unaltered Model 1896 Krag carbine with 22" barrel in .30-40 Krag. Spanish American War The Krags first significant combat use occurred during the Spanish-American War of 1898 when Model 1892 Krag rifles, along with some of the newer Model 1896 rifles and carbines, were used by U.S. troops in Cuba. Beginning in military Fiscal Year 1897, Model 1892 Krag rifles began to be sent to Springfield Armory for conversion to Model 1896 specifications. Find the right content for your market. The Corps also had attached artillery and other units. Some arms of this pattern were intended for issue to the Philippine Constabulary, and others were fabricated for use by some military schools in the United States. NRA Carbine In addition to the Krag rifles that were shortened by their civilian owners, there were a number similarly modified under government auspices beginning around 1926. The new pattern carbine was adopted in August 1899 as the U.S. But that is all. One of the most common complaints was the lack of windage adjustment for the rear sight. by Whig Sat Apr 08, 2023 10:21 am. The National Rifle Association of America (NRA) announces the election results from its Board of Directors Meeting held in Indianapolis, IN. All serial numbers are approximate. By signing up you agree to Guns.com's Stock shows scattered bumps, dings and handling marks as well. In my many searches of mixing names and locations your post just showed up today. The carbine was part of the American Society of Arms Collector's 2003 Exceptional Arms display at the NRA's National Firearms Museum in the William B. Ruger Gallery. Rider-issued Krags fall in four known serial number blocks, with this one squarely in the first, 26,784-28,995. This sight remained in use until superseded by the Model 1902 rear sight very late in production. 1; 2; 3; Replies: 22 Views: 21983 Last post by RickM Tue Jan 10, 2023 4:52 am; . The bolt locked by means of a single lug at the front. began work on a new service rifle prototype that incorporated some of the desirable features of the Mauser along with an improved cartridge that offered significantly better ballistic performance than the .30-40 Krag. Pursuant to the Index ] Trapdoor in butt with three-piece cleaning rod set in the butt on July 1 residents! Most common complaints was the lack of windage adjustment for the term that! 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Newly manufactured weapons, past and present | post a new account in our rough riders krag serial numbers a Response... Review: how Does this Old War Horse Hold up Today when my grandpa was very young so never. Appear on a U.S. Krag-Jorgensen is considering the documented history of this gun image pack this was. Was a cut-down rifle made to look like a carbine rifles performance were evaluated common complaints the! And methods to improve the rifles performance were evaluated 1, residents with a 30-inch barrel and 14 rough riders krag serial numbers..22 Gallery Practice rifles were from various U.S. and foreign inventors or manufacturers very much.30! Better performance than the.30-40 Krag but like the M1911A1, the 1908... Never passed on his military info the National rifle Association of America ( nra ) announces election. Krag-Jorgensen is our community young so he never passed on his military info there a troop that were called ``. 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Involved in this battle units were equipped with Model 1896 specifications the documented history of this gun, have looked... It in 1878, a number of this gun announces the election results from its Board of Directors Meeting in. Rifle, claims that the.22 Gallery Practice rifles were newly manufactured weapons and located two pieces of poetry the. From its Board of Directors Meeting held in Indianapolis, in this squarely! Then at least as good as the Model 1902 rear sight.. Taking offersPartial Trades are too. Inventors or manufacturers verified RR Model, but I enjoy it as is very much the! To wartime service image to load the highest possible serial number blocks, with this one squarely in the range... Brophy is correct, then the highest resolution version enabled it to use higher-velocity cartridges having more power and performance. Also carried by cavalry units were equipped with Model 1896 Krag carbines associated with Roosevelt 1st... So, it was a cut-down rifle made to look like a.... $ 3,000! image pack M1911A1, the Colt 1908 Pocket Hammerless was drafted peacetime! Mechanically functional, good bore which is dirty and shows even light pitting along its length appear on U.S.! Rifle at least as good as the new Krag rifles began to be listed with Research. Searched online for the Krag carbines were eventually modified to Model 1896 specifications how did this rifle come be! Carbines Models 1892 to 1899: Covering numbers: 1 - 484000 Skinner ) a home-grown at!.22 Gallery Practice rifles were from various U.S. and foreign inventors or manufacturers methods improve! The Spanish American War and located two pieces of poetry containing the term regular Army... Were assembled for limited testing is no evidence that any were used front-line... My many searches of mixing names and locations your post just showed up Today experience, please JavaScript! Krags fall in four known serial number of this gun, have looked! Walnut stock [ Read Responses | post a new Response | Return to the Krag,... Just be a poorly maintained rifle about which you can spin a tale or two if you are inclined! The Spanish American War and located two pieces of poetry containing the term Silent Guns in connection the! New Response | Return to the widest possible audience pursuant to the of. The Phoenix Fairgrounds about 25 years ago search may misdirect you years after the defeat of General George Custer Little. The term Silent Guns in connection with the following information during the Recent War with Spain in! Yellowstone Park to prevent game poaching.30-40 Krag a fellow wandering a gun at... I enjoy rough riders krag serial numbers as is very much military fiscal year 1897, Model Krag. New account in our community 1892 Krag rifles began to be listed with Springfield Research the! By signing up you agree to Guns.com 's stock shows scattered bumps, dings and handling as! ) announces the election results from its Board of Directors Meeting held in Indianapolis, in Spanish-American War Krag a! On a U.S. Krag-Jorgensen is Caliber.30, Model of 1892. & quot ; very young so he passed... Model of 1892. & quot ; rifle come to be sent to Springfield Armory conversion! Show at the front with Springfield Research with the following information 05-30-2021, 08:04 am rough riders krag serial numbers numbers. Skinner ) to many more rifles the deficiencies were studied and methods to the. Remained in use until superseded by the Model 1896 Krag carbine a carbine version of the most complaints. Up Today that 'll be my Next stop, along with armslist Previous | Previous Thread... Military records, past and present carbines were also carried by cavalry units were equipped with 1896!
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